Joe Dumars’s “Forward” Thinking

Nicely written, Deven!

Good article Deven!

I feel u on the whole “Mind of Dumars” thing. He’s a hard guy to figure out. I know one thing for sure tho Joe D see’s everything that we see wrong with the PISTONS but he see’s it months before we do, then he makes the appropiate moves. So I think we’ll be alright.

“In Joe D. We Trust”

Great article Deven, good way to make an emphatic post.

HUGE NEWZZZZZZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4295423

Charlie Villanueva is essentially heading to Detroit. Rumors are he’s the Pistons number big man target 9over Boozer). I told you there was more to what meets the eye with that Amir Johnson trade.

YESSSS MICHAEL CURRY FIRED!!!!!!!! LETS START A RIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OMG!!!! CURRY IS GONE!!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4297296

WHOA!!!!

Bring on BILL!!!

W000000000000000000000000000000tz!!!!!!

-Ali praises the lord-

Bring on Avery Johnson y’all! If anyone can teach Stuckey how to run the point, its him.

More importantly, I think you can’t hire Bill as the coach just yet. The organization needs a veteran coach to prove its serious to potential free agents. BUT, there is an assistant coach opening; I think you need to let him be an assistant coach until Avery’s contract expires. And then you decide who’s the better coach.

I don’t know that it really matters if the coach is veteran or not to attract free agents, but I do agree I would like to see Avery Johnson hired.

Didn’t Pistonscast just do an episode on Coach Curry being fired…

My head says Avery but my heart and my gut tells me Bill.

The older I get, the more I’m learning to follow my heart and trust gut.

My gut says, the team that gets Bill Laimbeer as a coach will not regret it!

As for my heart, how sweet would it be to have an original BAD BOY as coaching the Pistons? He’s been there and done that and he knows what it takes to win from both a player and coaching perspective.

Follow that heart!

The only thing against your statement is that they did hire someone from those old Piston days. Not that I’m comparing them, it’s just a point. ^-^

I suggest a show on our prospective team next year; coach through line-up. Whatcha think? Just a suggestion.

Astrid, when did Detroit hire someone to coach from the bad boys era? Are you referring to Michael Curry?

My guess is that Joe thinks that the Pistons need an experienced coach that could at least, guarantee that this ship get righted and not to mention someone to help develop and properly handle our young guys.

I think he’s leaning towards Doug Collins and Doug is saying that he wants back in coaching.

We’ll see!

Now that Boozer said officially that he will not opt out, I think we should sign Ben Gordon then trade Rip for Boozman.

More good new for us, well most of us. Carlo is gonna stay with Utah.

oops. Spelled Carlos wrong. Oh well.

Sorry, I didn’t mean the bad boys era specifically. Just meant old days.

You’d expect Curry to have some of that rub off on him through Dumars and such.

I can’t say I have experience, actually watching that backcourt in action (I was barely out of diapers <_<;) but from all I can tell it was still a great backcourt.

Either way, it doesn’t matter. Bill stepped down from the WNBA and we can’t have Brown back… Let’s just hope.

Joe D’s #1 free agent target should be… Bill Laimbeer! ;-D

I hope the Pistonscast Posse is right!

Give us Bill Laimbeer!

“Joe Dumars is the Best Ducker in a Rower out there!” HAHA!!! classic!

Question: Why would you fire a coach with little experience to hire a coach with NO NBA coaching experience??

Answer: You wouldn’t! Sorry guys but Bill Laimbeer will not be coaching the Pistons. That wouls go against everything Dumars stated as the reason to fire him. And don’t come back with that “he has coaching experience from the WNBA” crap. That is a far cry from coaching in the NBA. Sorry, it just is.

My feeling? It will be Avery Johnson. However, I have a scenario that may work out and please everyone. Maybe Joe hires Doug Collins as a temporary fix to right the ship and makes Doug agree to add Bill Laimbeer onto the staff as a potential successor?

Deven,
Interesting analysis. Let’s hope Joe got it right in 09. Either way, Coach Avery is going to make a huge difference.

I’m glad you didn’t go after my man Ricky Paulding again. It is not a big mistake when a guy drafted 54th doesn’t work out. Turns out Ricky is a star in Germany: http://www.mutigers.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/062909aaa.html.

We’re DIE-HARD fans TAD!!!! We don’t always want the truth!

“We can’t handle the truth!!”

I will definitely accept Bill coming on to assist doug even though I think Bill is one of those rare guys that can come out of the gate and lead.

@Astrid You better have your debit card out since you are requesting custom shows!

@ Steve M. Thanks for the Rickey Paulding siting! Nice to know he is using his talents to make a living!

It is being said that both Villanueva and Gordon are about to be offered deals. I’m not overly impressed, but maybe it will work. I wouldn’t offer either more than 4 year deals though.

If anyone can turn Stuckey into an all star point guard, it would be Avery Johnson. That would be Joe’s best move in a long time. But I’m concerned that Collins will be the coach again, word from an insider is that his name has been tossed around a lot. Not to mention he and Dumars are reportedly great friends and Collins had a fairly blatant response about coaching here.

Another thing is that Villanueva gives the team more scoring, but he’s not a low post player. We need a guy like Tyson Chandler to be competitive. But more importantly, how do these moves put us on par with SA, LA, Cle, Bos, etc?

I’m with you TADOne. I understand Dumars can’t turn it around in one year, but what room for improvement does he give himself with these moves? We’ll have no cap space after these guys, and neither of them are a “number 1 guy” as Dumars like to call them. What do you do in playoffs when LeBron puts 50 on you? Gordon can score, but he can’t put 50 at any given time.

I’m not trying to be pessimistic here, just realistic. I’m open to all options, but I don’t foresee a title for a good while.

Detnews.com reported that Ben Gordon verbally committed to 5 years 50 million.

http://www.detnews.com/article/20090701/SPORTS0102/907010390/1127/Sources–Ben-Gordon–Pistons-agree-to-deal

Now Villanueva agreed 5 years 35 million

Detroit is back!!!!!!!! Now trade Rip

I doubt that happens now, word is Curry was fired because of his rift with RIP. That would look awful on Joe’s reputation for him to do that.

well why would we intentionally create the a.i. situation all over again?

It’s not the AI situation. You’ve got two real guards and an explosive scoring 6th man in Gordan (as I told you before) combined with a rangy big man. Sound familiar? Its the Bad Boys. Minus the star point guard, the great coach, the defense or the toughness; you get the point.

Sometimes I really wonder who’s in control of the Pistons. Why sacrifice your only chance to get Wade and Bosh together for average players? Its gotta be the cheap management wanting to sell tickets. Think about it, had they paid some luxury tax,, we’d have 3 or 4 championships in the Billups era.

I love Villanueva’s contract. It’s Gordon’s that irks me.

no no no shoot me now if ben gordon comes off the bench, there is nothing good that can come from that

*ali sighs*

i don’t know what haves you so convinced that it will work. you think just cause it worked with v. johnson it will work with anyone we want to shove to the bench

Don’t believe me, ask John or Deven who should start. Also I never stated that I wanted Gordon here for that money in the first place.

it’s not about who should start, it’s about getting rid of rip

I was certain Rip was out until recently. Reportedly he and Curry weren’t talking for months after he was benched. Rip won that battle and he’s here to stay.

I don’t like this move either, but knowing what Dumar’ chief writer Langlois has been saying (and how he called the Villanueva move 2 weeks ago), we’re looking at a 3 guard line up.

This move has both its positives and negatives on Stuckey. It takes a lot of the scoring load off him, but it also means stuckey no longer has a chance to be the team leader and likely won’t develop into a star if he’s constantly differing to Gordon.

Ohh and you use a semicolon, not a comma, to conjoin two separate independent clauses. :p

@ Ali and Richard Ben Gordon is not coming to Detroit to come off the Bench.

Plain and Simple.

What do you do with Rip then? Every indication points to him staying right now.

I’ve been checking just about every resource at my disposal, and all people with insider information have been saying that Rip is likely to stay as the starter.

While I don’t think Ben Gordon is worth 55million, I think for 55million he’ll accept the role of coming off the bench as a sixth man. It’s not like didn’t do that for Chicago. I don’t know how I feel about this signing yet. Nobody really knows how this is gonna shape up until the season starts. But atleast these guys have something that Iverson didn’t, and thats time to learn the system and gel with the team. Iverson had to do that on the fly and it didn’t work out for him. Also, Gordon and Charlie might have will have a better coach too.

http://www.nba.com/2009/news/features/david_aldridge/07/01/pistons.signings/index.html

I’m telling you guys, Gordon is coming off the bench. All people with insider info are saying so.

I might wrong about a lot of things, but when Amir was traded I said that the Pistons would push for Villanueva and what’d ya know. And I’ve been saying Gordon would be coming off the bench for weeks and now legit analysts are saying the same thing. I’m telling you, these moves are very predictable judging by Joe’s past.

here’s another analyst saying exactly what I have been for the past 3 weeks; bad boys, bad boys, bad boys.
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4301267&categoryid=2459788

ok everyone ponder this. dont b afraid to tell me if this idea is wack cuz i havent looked into it, it just came to my head.1. re-sign sheed. 2. wut about we trade RIP, McDyess, Maxiell, and some money or something for Amare Stoudamire. starters would b. stuck, gordon, tay, sheed, and stoudamire

o ya. and resign walter hermann. i love that guy

This thread sure blew up in a day!

Ben Gordon’s not going to come to Detroit for that much money just to start the game in warm-ups.

I expect the Pistons to look to shop Rip out somewhere.

And guys, when you have a friendly discussion, there’s no room for personal attacks.

@Ali: Actually, there is cap space left.

“There are other considerations to the deal, of course. The Pistons still have enough cap space left to add one more free agent, so the deal remains open-ended yet. On the other side, they had to renounce rights to Rasheed Wallace, which doesn’t preclude them from re-signing him but makes it improbable. The one-year look the Pistons got at Allen Iverson could have gone either way. It went south, so you can add the snapping of their six-year run to the conference finals among the casualties of the trade.”

-Keith Langlois

@ Everyone Doug Collins has withdrawn from consideration for the head coaching job of the Detroit Pistons.

Collins told ESPN.com on Wednesday night that he called Joe Dumars to thank the Pistons president for considering him and to inform him of his preference to stay in television.

Avery Johnson is now easily the favorite for the position.

Via ESPN

So exciting recently!

Who’re we wanting for Rip?!

Artest looks to be eyeing the free agency up. It’s a long shot, but I’d love Artest. Maybe it’s just wishful thinking…

Trade RIP/Tayshaun for another big guy, we’re slacking at center.

John. I’ve said it once, and I’ll say it again.

I’ve got tuna sammiches, no debit card. ;P

They took Ben Wallace, We took Ben Gordon!

I think we should make an attempt at Amare, that would wrap things up nicely

@ Richard AMARE!!!! Now you are talking my man! Get that Boozer mess out of your head.

Focus on the Prize. Amare or Bosh.

yesss Amare’s been at the top of my wishlist for a looong time

I feel like I’m playing NBA 2K9 or something reading all these posts. Lets get serious and think about landing a good coach to compensate for all this top notch talent yall talking bout picking up. How are u gonna coach players with ego’s as big as the ones we have on this team. Have u ever thought about that? The players are just as much a reason for the last two coach’s we had being fired than anything else!

I’m just saying before everybody talks about we need this person and trade that person, let’s focus on getting a QUALITY coach. All these video game teams is getting ridiculous

I think you’re better off waiting on free agency for Amare. Phoenix is asking for a lot in return, they’re not just giving him away as previously thought.

Mike, Avery Johnson is a quality coach. He lead a team to 60 and 67 wins in first stint as a coach, not to mention was thought of as a player coach back in the day

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/news/story?id=4302507

BAM. Ben Gordon just confirmed that Joe Dumars is trying to recreate the Bad Boys. Props anyone?

Plus he got to the NBA finals… and has a nice smile.

Yeah Avery would be nice

Mike’s diggin’ his smile too.

when do yall think joe will make his next move?

No later than next week. My guess is he’ll make a play for Chandler or Kayman. We need a shot blocker but don’t have much to offer beyond Tay or cheap contracts. If Chandler’s foot checks out, I think that’s their first option.

If he gets a shot blocker/rebounder, that greatly changes the dynamic of these two signings. The team won’t win a title anytime soon, but they’ve got a good chance of making it out of the first round.

Another guy I like is Marcin Gortat. I brought him a few months ago at the start of the playoffs and he’s really looking like a solid 25 min center. Not a starter just yet, but a great second banana.

I agree and disagree. I think the next move will happen soon but I think Kaman is trash. Chandler’s fine but not Kaman and why not target someone better like Bosh, Boozer, or Stoudemire?

Ok, i’ll add my two cents:

1) I think Dumars is still shopping Rip, regardless of whether or not Curry is gone. Curry was just a lame duck coach regardless of the rift between him and Rip. I think, because teh salaries match up, that Rip may be traded for Kaman.

2) I believe Curry was fired because the players on the team, including Rip, had soured on him so bad that his rep was shot thruout the league. Joe HAD to do something before the free agency period started to attract free agents. So Curry was let go. It is not a coincidence it happened just hours before the FA negotiation period started. Trust.

3) I also believe Tay is on the trading block. We just drafted 3 SF/PF combos in the draft and have Walter Sharpe from last year. If Rip doesn’t get moved, look for whoever is coaching to play Stuck, BG, and Rip together alot. BG may still come off the bench, but will still get starters minutes. This isn’t the same as the AI fiasco because BG will not come in causing waves.

4)The coach will be Avery. It will more than likely be announced by Monday or Tuesday.

Another thing: Why is everyone in the thinking that we can even get Bosh, Boozer, or Stoudemire? If you haven’t noticed, Detroit is not exactly at the top of the list as potential FA destinations. If a reasonable trade could have been done, i’m quite sure Dumars would have pulled the trigger by now. Without thinking twice. Basically, Dumars did the best he could with what he had.

@TAD We have no chance without Bosh or Amare. Seriously. We are used to championships not 2nd round appearances!

no one is saying that we will land any of them through free agency. we are simply suggesting that we should attempt to trade for one of them. and the reason it hasn’t happened yet is because Joe probably has a deal in place that was dependent on which free agents we signed. so that means Joe d hasn’t pulled the trigger just yet because he needed to wait and see who he could land from free agency, and now before he pulls the trigger on a deal like that he needs to get a coach in place. so when a coach is hired, i will be expecting some kind of trade.

What about Tayshaun for David West? West averaged 21 points and 8.5 rebounds last season. We could then slide Rip over to the 3 spot or trade him elsewhere. The salaries match, we would take on 300k from west but it would be well worth it. Anyone agree?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ndua7r

John the problem is Bosh will likely walk if you trade for him (he wants to be in Miami) so you lose a player for nothing. And while Amare is more likely to resign, Pheonix wants too much for him. They wanted 3 above average players on top of Stephen Curry, how do you expect to get him without trading the entire team?

I think that people are overlooking how talented Villanueva actually is. He averaged “only” 16 and 7, but in well under 30 minutes. His numbers per 40 were 23 and 10. I think with the right coach to put a foot up his ass, he’s got a good shot to actually outperform Bosh because he’s got the same range but a much better body.

But more importantly, Rodney Stuckey will determine whether this team wins a title. He needs to learn not only how to run the offense, but also become a team leader off the court. I think with the right coach he can learn the position, but he has to find the leadership on his own.

Either way, Rip’s not going anywhere. Ben Gordon confirmed in an interview that Dumars wants to do another bad boys like 3 guard line up with him, Rip, and Stuckey. So more than likely we’re looking at adding a shot blocker this year and then waiting for some draftees to develop in order to do a trade down the road.

“http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/news/story?id=4302507 BAM. Ben Gordon just confirmed that Joe Dumars is trying to recreate the Bad Boys. Props anyone?”

Uhh, this just says the Bulls never offered him a contract.

Why does it keep telling me
“Your comment is awaiting moderation.”

whenever you post a link, or post from a new computer your post has to approved.

Thats the blogging software looking out for spammers.

Ryan listen to about the halfway mark, its in there that Joe told Ben he wants to have another 3 guard line up like Isiah, himself and vinnie

Stuckey, Gordon and Hamilton?

For serious?

Hamilton is as tough as condensed milk.

…

Mmm..

I always said we should shop Ariza. Now he’s in Houston.

hey Astrid watch what u say bout RIP

Well anyway I was saying we should pursue David West

Actually Astrid, if you look at Rip’s numbers on 82 games, he’s got the best net value on the team.

Surprisingly enough, BG has a massive net PER when he plays SF. I think the 3 guard lineup can work, but we need a legit defensive center and one more shot blocker.

I think our best move right now is to pursue Tyson Chandler and then trade Tay for Josh Smith. Josh Smith has a massive defensive improvement when he plays SF, but his offensive stats go down. At this point we’ve got plenty of firepower, so that shouldn’t be an issue.

Richard, believe it or not, but villanueva is actually better than West, especially with money in mind.

CV gets more rebounds per 40 and the same number of blocks. CV gets more points per 40 than West does. They have about the same percentage of shots assisted, but keep in mind that CP3 is 50 times better than Luke Ridnour (who clearly brought down some of those numbers). They same get the same % of shots blocked.

And if take into consideration that West west mediocre until CP3 came around, I think that Villanueva is clearly the better option because of his similar/better production and much lower price tag.

True but wouldn’t a pair of CV and West be pretty strong? I like it

Richard, I love Rip, he’s just a defensive liability at the 3.

This team needs a center born from a nuclear explosion if they ever want to win a title. West just is not that kind of defensive player, not to mention he is unproven without CP3. Not worth the risk imo.

The more I think about it, Samuel Dalembert seems to be the most logical option right now. I’m not sure Chandler will ever be back to all star form again, while Dalembert has quietly been having monster seasons.

He had 14 rebounds and 3 blocks per 40 last season. More importantly he had a very low usage rate, meaning he’s effective without the ball (something this team desperately needs).

So stats wise, he’s our man. Better yet, Philly wants to get rid of him. The only question is why do they want to get rid of him so badly when he’s dominant statistically?

Another option would be Joel Przybilla. As great as Dalembert was, Przybilla had slightly better rebounding numbers. They were both just a hair behind Dwight Howard to put it in perspective.

Only thing is I’m not sure Portland will just give him up. They’ve got Oden, but we all know he hasn’t panned out just yet.

Either way, both these guys quietly had much better numbers than Chandler did last year.

I had to laugh when I saw your first two picks as Dalembert and Pryzbilla. I’m sorry but both of these players are awful. Pryzbilla reminds me of a more polished Darko and Dalembert just sucks.
All I can say is I’m glad I’m not Joe Dumars right now, he’s got a real job on his hands.

Really, they both suck? You’re looking at the surface, they both play around 20 minutes a game. Look at their numbers per 40, they’re ranked 2dn and 3rd behind Big D. Coincidence? I think not.

Just a year before, in slightly more minutes, Dalembert had over 10 rebounds a game in just over 30 minutes. Przybilla posted similar numbers last year and seems to be improving. Not a fluke we’re talking about.

Also Dalembert is 5th in the league in blocks per minute, a huge thing we’re missing. On top of that Przybilla has the 4th least fouls per minute, another huge thing we need (guys that can actually stay on the floor).

Richard I keep telling you, you have to look beyond the surface to see a player’s impact. Chandler was considerably worse than both these guys (it wasn’t even close). Also this is why I think Villanueva was a steal; his numbers per 40 are 24 and 10. THAT’S MORE THAN BOSH.

Do yourself a favor, and go to either the stat section of ESPN or 82games.com and look up some centers. Don’t just look at their numbers, but look at their numbers per 40 (that’s the best way to compare since they’ll be playing 30+ minutes here, but you never play 48 minutes a game). Also look at how their opponent fared against them (per, rebounds, percentage blocked, etc). keep in mind to look only at players that play at least 20 minutes a game. Quite simply, if they don’t, there’s a reason. I think you’ll be pleasently surprised that there’s a lot more than meets the eye about the guys I bring up.

The ball may occasionally lie, but numbers don’t.

If you were given 2 players (A and B) and were given their numbers (I would do per 40 for equal footing). You know the players are LaMarcus Aldridge and CV31. 9 out of 10 people would probably say Aldridge had the better numbers - based off name recognition, when in fact, its not even close. Aldridge averaged 19 and 8. CV31 averaged a massive 24 and 10.

My point is we have to start looking purely at the numbers, followed by price tag, and then name.

“Moving forward with Detroit, one thing Joe told me he wanted to create was that 3-guard offense that they used to have back in the ‘Bad Boy’ days when it was him, Isiah, and ‘The Microwave.’ I think with Rip, Rodney Stuckey and myself - we’re no Isiah, Joe, and Microwave but I think anytime you have three guards of that caliber, it makes it a tough matchup.”

-Ben Gordon

Per 40 is geared more towards efficiency ratings rather than actually stats so those numbers can’t be accurately projected. Because what you’re saying is that Dalembert is better than Bosh purely because the per 40 numbers say so. You need to take your own advice and look a little beyond the surface. Going by your numbers I’d say Dalembert is a superstar that deserves a max contract!

I never said Dalembert is better than Bosh. I said Villanueva’s per 40 numbers are better than Bosh’s. You take it with a grain of salt, but the point is with enough playing time, he has the potential to be better.

Richard I do look beyond surface and I know there’s a reason why Dalembert doesn’t play 40 minutes a night. But at the same time you’ve still got Kwame Brown to fill 20 minutes. So from there you look at the guy with the most efficiency to fill in the other 25 minutes.

Ohh and if you’re going to insult me, do a little better than job than just reversing my own words.

I wasn’t trying to insult you don’t turn this into an argument again, its just a discussion, so calm down. Why do you try to turn every thing into a fight? Villanueva has potential but not nearly as much as you give him credit for. He will never be a player of Bosh’s caliber. Don’t get me wrong he will be a great player but not at the superstar status that Bosh is.

Another thing to consider is that Portland failed to get Turkoglu.

If you trade Tay for Przybilla (and perhaps a draft pick), with all other contracts and the cap decrease in consideration, the Pistons would have between $7-8 million in cap space.

With that money, you could sign a guy like Marvin Williams or Brandon Bass. Both are good shot blockers, and Williams is a lock down defender while Bass is another big to add to the rotation.

Richard, keep in mind that in all but 2 of his most productive years, Chandler played below 30 minutes a game. You don’t have to play 40 minutes a night to be considered an impact player, you just have to pllay with high intensity. So I’ll take the guy with the higher efficiency plus the cap space over an injured former all star.

Interesting, but I would never trade Tayshuan in a salary dump. NEVER. Especially for a player like Pryzbilla. Tay still has relative value in this league. We can make a solid trade facilitating him. Also, Bass can probably be had for about 4-5 million.

The ‘Richard and Ali Show’ brought to you by Pistonscast - home of the die hard Pistons fans.

Please dont trade Tay. i luv tay. he is my fav piston. i would cry if joe d. traded him away.

Deven, John, would 100 comments make this the most.. commented post of all time? ;D

Currently at 95!

But see that’s the value of that extra $7-8 million. You can turn that into Bass and another player. There’s Matt Barnes, Zaza Pachulia, etc.

I personally would take Gortat over Bass because the team already has plenty of offense, but that’s just me.

I don’t see what you have against Przybilla, he’s more productive than Tashaun is on his own, let alone him and 2 other players. Give me one legit reason why you don’t like Przybilla that doesn’t include he’s erratic or that he’s not a star. His play has been very consistent and he’s the second best rebounder per minute in the league.

Another thing you have to take into consideration is that you could probably get an all star in return for Tayshaun, but you’d also have to take on a lot of salary. That’s not gonna happen, the palace management is cheap and refuses to go into the luxury tax.

That’s why I like Przybilla, that gives you both a very productive center and a lot more flexibility this year or going into the 2010 free agency because he has an option, not guaranteed money after this year.

@Ali Brandon Bass…

What about Bass? If you traded Tay for Przybilla, you could get Bass with the additional cap space

Ali, While both those guys can help a team out, I think what John means is that those are nuts & bolts players and nuts & bolts don’t go in until after you’ve built your frame.

Yes astrid, this is the most by far!

I fully understand that, which is why I hate the Ben Gordon move. It sucked up nearly all the cap space we had for a 6th man (yes Gordon is on the record saying he will come off the bench in a 3 guard lineup).

I don’t expect a title for a number of years, not until Dumars starts drafting better and gets the pieces for a major trade. But until then, you try to make the best roster you can.

I personally feel the team would be better off with two productive bigs than Tayshaun, but that’s just me. If you can find another trade that works for both teams that includes a better player, I’m all for it.

Ok stop suggesting Pryzbilla for Tay, that is obviously never going to happen. And the reason I hate Pryzbilla is because he flatout sucks. He averaged 5.5 points last season. We would be better of swapping Tayshaun for a pile of trash. And about Bass, we don’t need another Maxiell on this roster.

Like Ben Gordon or not, I definitely wouldn’t call him a nuts and bolts player. If Derrick Rose was the Bulls engine last season, then Ben Gordon was damn sure the transmission.

Yeah Astrid, it’s been the most commented, but the hardest to read because people seem to be taking cheap shots at each other instead of having a friendly sports discussion like the comment thread is meant for.

All I want to say at this point is that I’m looking forward to this upcoming season and what it brings.

Yeah, Ben Gordon kept the “car” running and without him, I don’t think the Bulls go to 7 games against the Celtics.

It’s always hard Ryan.

I’m not much into the long discussions about every players worth.

We know what they can do, we watch them, we love (or hate) them.

I’m happy with the trades. Just wondering who’s going to be our center. Kwame does fine, not much hustle but he makes a solid back-up and can play the starting minutes until we hopefully find someone better.

Richard, tell me who you’re after. If its Chandler, here are several reasons (on top of salary, health and rebounding) why Przybilla is a better option.

Przybilla converts a HIGHER PERCENTAGE THAN CHANDLER from close range and dunks. Besides, almost all of Chandler’s points come from lob passes from Chris Paul, that’s been well documented. Look at Chandler’s numbers before he had CP3, he was between 5 to 8 ppg each year. Przybilla actually has a post game and uses it on 50% of his possessions, meaning he’ll be effective to a certain degree on all teams.

Yes Przybilla is not a great scorer, but you aren’t paying for one. You have $8 mil in cap space left over for a player who puts up better numbers than Chandler. Use that money in a salary dump and you’ve got an all star on your hands. And either way, how do you expect to get a true offensive center anyways? Teams don’t just give those guys away for free.

Gordon was an important player on his team, but look closer at his numbers. Chicago allowed 5 more points per 100 possessions with Gordon on the floor compared to off. His opponents averaged well above 50% eFG. That’s HUGE. Many times when Gordon went for big numbers, his opponent also put up huge numbers. Ben Gordon goes for 33, Joe Johnson has a career high 41. BG goes for 43, Wade goes for 48. You just can’t win in the playoffs that way.

Look guys, I enjoy posting up ideas, and I like to have positive criticism. But seriously, I do spend a lot of time looking at the statistics before I bring up ideas. I would like you guys to be more considerate of that.

Another defensive center option would be Emaka Okafor. While he’s a great defender, he’s also much much expensive than Przybilla and doesn’t rebound as well as Przybilla or Dalembert. Also Dalembert blocks more shots.

@ Ali Everyone Loves You… but stop bringing up sucky defensive centers.

Either we get a Ben Wallace type of defender (which we are not)

or we need Bosh or Amare.

Thats it.

We have a championship culture and we arent going to win another title with Chandler, Okafor, Dalembert, Pryz or whoever else works “cap wise”.

Boston has a defensive center and they won a title. Orlando has a defensive center and they nearly won a title. Not to mention Bosh and Amare are both PF, not centers. You need defense. Numbers don’t lie.

Bosh isn’t a guy that could lead his team by himself. He’s very consistent, but he’s peaked, not to mention look at Toronto’s record. True superstars like Duncan, LeBron or Wade have always produced playoff teams. He’s very good, but you need to place another guy with him to win.

Amare on the other hand is a real number 1, but you have to play him with a real defensive center. He’s a good help side shot blocker, but bad one on one.

Either way John, its impossible to get those guys without the proper cap space or pieces to trade. Please explain how you plan to get those guys when Pheonix wanted a young promising center, 2 other rotation pieces and Stephen Curry. If you trade for Przybilla to get $8 mil in cap space, you get a serviceable defensive center and can get an all star in a salary dump. Now you actually have some pieces to trade.

Be realistic guys. Honestly, I’m getting tired of being told my plans are sucky when they are the only ones that actually are doable in the foreseeable future. Out of the over 100 comments, I’m the only person that actually contributed plausible scenarios. Not one other person said hey, I don’t like these guys, but I’ve done my research and I think player XX would work better and here’s how you get him.

I don’t have a problem getting Chandler for say, Maxiell and Kwame. I Think the combination of him and Boozer (after trading Rip), will give us enough talent to compete with anybody. All we would need is the right coach.

I think at the end of the day four good players is better than just getting Bosh. That would be too much pressure to put one player.

Beating Lebron is going to take a team effort !!

@ Ali You get Amare because Steve Kerr is type of GM to give a player away.

Was Ben Wallace for Shaq even. No.

You dont get Superstars in this league because of plausible trades anymore.

When another team is unhappy, you strike while the Iron is hot. Gasol trade, Garnett trade, Vince Carter trade.

No trade for a superstar is ever truly even.

So what you do is show a commitment to that Superstar player, show them you are going to do everything it takes to compete for a championship and you make that trade for a Max Contract Player!

PS. Boston did not win because of Kendrick Perkins. That was all KG, Ray Allen and Paul Pierce. Until we get a trio of All Star/Hall of Famers, we cant just plug in a defensive center and expect to win.

Ben Wallace was a once a generation player. Thats why Im saying we need to get that Hybrid big man to compete for a championship.

We cant settle for mediocre players just because it makes sense.

@ Deven and everyone else. As much as I dislike Boozer I would definitely trade Rip Hamilton for him.

Now Ali if we get Boozer, then you get your Center. Pryz is actually decent… except at free throws!

How about that compromise?

John I was thinking along the same lines until draft week. Look at what Phoenix wants for Amare, they sure as hell are NOT giving him away for free.

They wanted Andris Beidrins (a guy I would love to have myself, he’s a very promising center), 2 quality rotation players and Stephen Curry. We just don’t have that to offer.

And thank you for finally acknowledging than Pryzbilla is a decent player. I’m telling you, I don’t just look on rosters trying to find who teams want to give away.

With all due respect, Ali, you’ve basically told everyone here that they’ve contributed absolutely nothing and that you’re the only one writing anything of worth. When someone doesn’t agree with what you’ve written, you seem to be at odds with them the whole rest of the comment thread!